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Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
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Posted - 2012.04.10 18:17:00 -
[1] - Quote
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Our plan for this is basically to make the changes, see where prices end up settling and then potentially make further adjustments (to the game as a whole) to react to this.
Just keep in mind that you're not going to have "settled prices" until probably July/August as it will take that long before things start to settle down. Making any decisions about further adjustments before mid-July (at the earliest) would be premature.
And most of the "expected" price levels are already priced into the market within the past few days. Things probably won't go up much more long-term then they are now, otherwise ore ends up worth too much on an ISK/m3 basis. That puts hi-sec ore at around 150-200 ISK/m3 and null-sec ABCs in the 500-600 range (and Morphite at around 13-15k).
But there will definitely be some short-term price shocks between Apr 24th and May/June. |
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
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Posted - 2012.04.11 14:07:00 -
[2] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:Houm... so miners now spend 300 million ISK to set up a Hulk and earn 6 million an hour, and that should change for spending 400 million in a Hulk to earn 8 million an hour. 
a) People bought hulks back when they were 400-500M ISK. If they couldn't afford that then they stayed in their Covetors (which are only 15% worse then a hulk at max skills).
b) Since hi-sec ores are currently in the 150-220 ISK/m3 range and a solo Hulk pilot can mine about 100k m3/hr, that means today's hulk pilots are earning 15-22M ISK/hr. Which makes it a lot easier to afford that new hulk, even when using a Covetor.
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Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
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Posted - 2012.04.12 01:33:00 -
[3] - Quote
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
I would love to see your sources, as my own experience is closer to 75k m3 per hour (18k hold, roughly 4 shifts per hour) and they would sell for about 5 to 6 million ISK. And I am talking about the best priced mineral in my neck of the woods, you know. Veldpsar would hand out some 4 million at most (which made easy to spot bots, as nobody else cared about veldspar).
Standard (1) MLU2 Hulk fit with (3) MSM2 and (5) Mining Drone I pulls in 93k m3 of ore per hour in a perfect world, that goes up to 96k m3 if you have all level V skills. The T1 mining drones add 13% to your output, otherwise you'd only be getting 85k/hr. Add T2 mining drones and that goes up to 104k m3/hr. Subtract 6 minutes each hour for hauling and you end up right around 90-95k m3/hr. Fits which sacrifice all tank get another 7-8% from the 2nd MLU2.
Add boosts from an Orca and you'll pickup another 40-65% production per hour.
It's also your decision to stay and mine Veldspar at 175 ISK/m3 when you could move 10-15 jumps and get Pyrox at 220 ISK/m3 (25% more pay per hour). |
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
859
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Posted - 2012.04.12 15:01:00 -
[4] - Quote
gfldex wrote:
I'm all for big cans of worms as I have to capital to make good profits of them. But I would prefer if you would have plan B on your table and a swift way to deploy it. So how does that plan look like?
One "Plan B" for them would be to "fix" some of the null-sec ores which are still pretty bad, like Spod and Gneiss.
Today's ore prices (+/- 5%)
Veld 178 Scor 156 Pyro 222 Plag 161 Omb 104 Kern 166 Jasp 276 Hemo 320 Hedb 308
Gneiss 181 DarkO 294 Spod 131 Croc 388 Bist 389 Ark 470
Trit 5.92 Pye 6.87 Mex 53.5 Iso 93.36 Nocx 942 Zyd 1869 Mega 3575 Morph 11394
Jasp/Hemo/Hedb are all pretty balanced.
The problem is that Gneiss and Spod trail way far behind DarkO. Most of that is due to the ore size being so large. If Gneiss' ore size was dropped from 5.00 m3/u down to 3.00 m3/u, it would boost Gneiss from 181 to 301. Which would put it right in line with the other low-sec ores. Spod has a similar problem and needs to be changed from 16 m3/u down to 7.5 m3/u, which would boost it from 131 to 279, bringing it right in line with the low-sec ores and the ABCs.
Or they could also consider boosting the yield on T2 strips, making both the T1 & T2 crystals better.
Or improve the barges / exhumers. Such as bringing the Procurer up to the Retty's current production level, as the Procurer is currently a joke of a hull, outmined by moderately skilled mining cruisers. Bring the Retty's production level up to be halfway between the old Retty and the Covetor. Add more low/mid slots and PG to the Covetor & Hulk to make them more powerful to increase m3/hr potential. |
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
859
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
gfldex wrote:Scrapyard Bob wrote:One "Plan B" for them would be to "fix" some of the null-sec ores which are still pretty bad, like Spod and Gneiss. If you boost Gneiss you boost -0.001 systems. The whole idea of 0.0 is that it's Deep Space. And that means it's far off the road. I would prefer to have ABCD to have more low and med mins over making any 0.0 way better then lowsec. Proper compression seams to be the best way IMHO. There should be something coming from highsec to 0.0 that is not ISK or POS fuel.
Low-sec and null-sec are roughly tied for "risk", especially for miners in low-sec where you can't wall off the system with bubbles. It also doesn't change the fact that Gneiss is undervalued due to the size of the ore units, when compared to the other low/null ores. It lags hard and either you add more units (which messes up everyone's refine tables) or you simply lower the size of the ore (which increases yield/hr without screwing up refine tables).
Even dropping Gneiss from 5.00 m3/u down to 3.50 m3/u would be a significant improvement, while not quite as overpowered as moving it from 5.00 to 3.00 m3/u. At 3.50 m3/u, Gneiss would end up worth around 259 ISK/m3, which is still below the low/null ores, but not as bad as it is now. |
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
859
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Posted - 2012.04.13 12:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:
0.0 belts don't have infinite amounts of every ore. Once all the ABCM is gone, it's gone until the belt respawns (2x a week?). If the values of other ores are worth undocking the Hulks for, they'll get mined.
All belts now refill daily at downtime (changed a few years ago). The rocks will start as small pebbles if they were mined completely out and will grow into larger asteroids on the following days (if left alone).
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Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
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Posted - 2012.04.14 02:12:00 -
[7] - Quote
Draconus Lofwyr wrote:if you want to do something for the carebears, perhaps do something about the abysmal drop rate on the Mining Foreman Mindlink, They are starting to break the 1 bil mark on the market.
They need to add those implants to the in-game LP stores, in addition to being random drops.
They also need to follow through on the vague promise to let players construct implants. Ideally by adding 5-run or 10-run BPCs to the LP stores (and as random loot drops in Exploration sites) and using a combination of T1 salvage, Planetary Interaction materials, minerals and moon goo in the bill of materials.
(In fact, if there were limited run BPCs for all of the implants, CCP could change all the existing implant drops into BPCs. Which would make things more player-driven.) |
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
873
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Posted - 2012.04.18 11:24:00 -
[8] - Quote
Draconus Lofwyr wrote:
just increase the me/pe on the meta to match the meta level to lower the "cost" of building that should bring back the meta 1-3 items as the meta 4+ items will just be that much rarer.
There's a few ways you could go:
- Meta 1-3 BPCs with random ME/PE levels (ME could range between 0 and 5x meta level, PE could range between 0 and 2x meta level). This would probably require that the contract UI be changed slightly to display ME/PE level of BPOs/BPCs without having to look at contract details.
- Higher meta levels require more minerals then the base T1 item, plus supplementary materials from other resource pools instead of just being built with minerals.
- Fixed ME/PE level BPCs (no variation, all drops the same), which require the meta-zero item plus supplementary materials.
- Higher meta level BPCs which have negative ME/PE levels (starting at -1/-1 for meta-1 going up to -4/-4 for meta 4).
- If different ME/PE levels are in play, then store-sold BPCs should always be equal or worse then the BPCs that drop as loot. Otherwise nobody would buy the looted BPCs. In the case of negative ME, then the store sold BPCs should always have one more negative ME then the worst of the drops. In the case of positive ME, you'd want to simply make the store sold BPCs as ME zero. |
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
885
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Posted - 2012.04.23 00:21:00 -
[9] - Quote
Don Kartel wrote:
Demand out strips supply massively and people hate mining for hours on end. mining is the worst thing in the game and pvp'ers are going to suffer becuase ship prices have just doubled in some cases
Simple law of MMOs and markets in general. If it's a job that you don't want to do because it's too difficult / boring / menial / hard / lengthy, then you're going to have to pay someone else to do it.
Your choices are:
- Fly cheaper and reduce your personal demand.
- Help increase supply (become a miner).
- Help others increase supply (help guard the miners).
- HTFU and pay more.
And prices cannot increase infinitely because at some point the harvesting income will become better then flat-rate ISK income such as missions. When miners can make more ISK/hr mining in hi-sec then L4 mission runners can make, then more people start mining and fewer people run missions. This increases the mineral supply while at the same time decreases the ISK faucets.
(Prices are actually, other then the speculation driving stuff up 20-30% above where they normally would be, right around where I expect things to settle in come July/August.) |
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